A few months ago, someone mentioned that a dude had walked to Crestone from Pueblo — which is a SERIOUS walk over some very rugged mountains — and that he was some kind of Sasquatch expert. I was intrigued, but I have to admit that I assumed the guy was a wild-eyed wayward soul who’d had a bit too much psilocybin and not enough common sense. Then I met Mateo at a party and after chatting with this totally chill, reasonable, obviously smart dude for a while, I realized … wait a minute, THIS is the Squatch dude?
Your lack of experience in interviewing a 'Squatcher' is telling! Don't you know the *most* important question to get to know their stance of the matter is: Shooting a Sasquatch (if you had the chance), Yay or Nay??
;)
Thanks for the veiled shoutout BTW (I'm the friend with a very peculiar opinion about UFOs to anyone reading this). As with the other 'Fortean' mysteries I have studied most of my life, I grew skeptical of the simplistic notion that Bigfoot is simply an undiscovered large hominid roaming North America. A commenter here has already written how First Nation peoples consider them to be a creature living "in between" worlds, and I find that concept fascinating.
Think about it, Mateo's experience happened in a place considered to be 'haunted' by the locals, and yet the *only* reason he determined his first experience to be the work of some prankish primates is because it happened OUTSIDE.
The same way when people see a strange light floating around a military base they think "UFO!" but if the same phenomena happened inside a creepy old mansion they would think "GHOST!"
My smartest Fortean friends consider Sasquatch to be a sort of "poltergeist of the forest" and I think they are on the right track, no pun intended ;)
Anyway, great episode, and I will finish by mentioning I had a chuckle when Mateo conceded that thinking about all this stuff makes one question the nature of reality —SPOILER ALERT: THAT'S THE WHOLE FREAKING POINT :P
I usually love the podcast but found myself checking the date to make sure it wasn't recorded on April 1st and we weren't being had. Another sasquatch "encounter" with no good photos or any evidence - amazing how no one ever gets those! (but we have plenty of night cam footage of mountain lions and all manner of creatures in the forest) And you didn't even actually see one? Dude it could have been anything.
Cool interview Chris—comforting to see your embracing the local Sqatchiness experiences.. If people want a real trip then have a listen to Mike Paterson’s interviews and research.Here in Australia the indigenous peoples of the Yuin Nation call them Dooligah or Yowie.Several Elders that I have spoke to believe that they shape shift and there are sacred sites that are know portals that they shift in and out of. Check out Yowie hunters Witness reports. If anything comes from any of these stories (believing or not) it can give a deeper insight to build the mind bridge from constructed reality and unconscious dream worlds.Like how quantum mechanics is shifting peoples understandings of reality.Peace to the peaceful …Chris your making a difference man with all you do—-big respect and love to you:-)»»»»>
Great episode! Chris, asking a Marine vet if he’s a “Semper fi guy” was hilarious. I’ve never heard that one before.
You guys touched on what it’s like to “come out” as a Sasquatch experiencer. I’d like to hear more about that. I’ve heard that a lot of people don’t discuss their experiences much. The whole thing is kinda like talking about being a veteran. Some vets barely mention that they served because some civilians can be weird about that. People sometimes make assumptions about a Marine combat vets sanity as do people make assumptions about filks who say that they have seen a Sasquatch.
Semper Fi Mateo. I served with 3bn 7th Marines as an infantry man from 04’ to 08’ it’s nice to hear a fellow Marine on the podcast.
Im weighing in here perhaps prematurely haha (still on Chris's intro)
But felt an urge to mention that First Nation peoples view Sasquatch as some kind of spirit creature. In some 'in-between' realm. Perhaps dimensionally, or in terms of consciousness and perception....
Interesting episode! I figure I'd drop some random thoughts I had while listening.
As someone who was trained as a satellite technician in the Air Force (now I'm a commercial radio technician) satellites are extremely devoid of power. The majority run on solar power and there wouldn't be near enough power for weaponized lasers. Nuclear power could be used but the amount of power a laser in space would need to destroy a target 22k miles away (if the satellite is in geosynchronous orbit) would be astronomical.
I think your spot on with the drone. It reminds me of something George Carlin said on Dennis Miller's show about why he joined the Air Force "I'd rather fly over the area, drop some bombs, fly home, take a shower, and go out dancing." But I would add that those Nellis Air Force airmen piloting drones have a significant percentage that develop PTSD. Not as high as an infantry man but it still happens nonetheless.
that argues every increase of 1,000 black bears in an ecosystem results in a 4% increase in sasquatch sightings. I feel like sasquatch, or any outlier theory for that matter, is an archetype for one or two particular psyches. Those that enjoy the mystery of the unknown or those with an intolerance to ambiguity. The second one in particular is something that I see a lot in different spaces. It drives people to fill in gaps of the unknown with narrative. I see that a lot at work as some technicians can't stand troubleshooting an issue without predetermining what the problem is because it makes them uncomfortable to let the equipment, system, radio, etc. "tell" them the issue. Most the time it sends them down a rabbit whole and out the other side before they find the issue.
At the same time, I get it. I think anyone that's ever been camping in a remote location sitting inside your tent hearing thuds, animals moving around, or grunts, automatically imagine all kinds of possibilities. In those moments of vulnerability anything is conceivable.
The problem with the aquatic ape hypothesis is that most of the supposed aquatic adaptations have other more easily explainable explanations. For example, the nose arching downward is well understood to cause turbulence in the air allowing it to absorb moisture on the way in and eject it on the way out.
The tear thing I have never heard but I do know a couple of things. 1) generally tears, sweat, and saliva, and blood all have the same salinity, about 1% of the total weight of these fluids is from the salt. 2) Water is attracted to sodium and our body takes advantage of this fact by releasing sodium in our sweat gland channels and tear ducts which causes water to chase the sodium up and out of the channels/ducts to the surface of our skin. 3) The higher the intensity of the exercise the higher the sodium content in sweat (if I remember right it can range from something like 400 mg/L to 1800 mg/L but even this changes with heat acclimation). 4) Basal/reflex tears have high salt content (i.e. the 1% while emotional tears are more watery but also contain more hormones. 5) Sea water is on average about 3.5% salinity. I don't know what the tear salinity of aquatic mammals. Maybe dolphins and whales have 1% salinity in their tears. But with the amount of sodium variation in tears and sweat I'd be interested to know when and how it was measured to get the result that went along with the aquatic ape hypothesis.
On humans alone, I have probably 60 or so sweat gland/epithelial bud studies from the 1960s to present and I've never seen it suggested that apocrine glands (the glands that secrete oily/waxy liquid) develop on the head, shoulders, and back. There's a ton of research on the density of eccrine glands on the head (especially forehead) and rest of the body but apocrine glands are usually only found in the underarm/pubic region. Again, I'd like to see where that data was coming from.
In 1987 Kenzo Sato and Fusako Sato talked about a hybrid gland they called the apoeccrine gland that was supposed to be a type of super gland. This gland was still only found in the arm pit area. More recently, researchers have been unable to replicate their findings and see no evidence for this apoeccrine gland.
Two more observations before I call it a day. Does the creator of the aquatic ape hypothesis ever explain how hominins avoided crocodiles in neck deep water? I've often wondered about that. Crocs invade every body of water, and even mud pits. The only thing I could think is if this aquatic existence took place in higher elevations where it was too cold for crocs to exist for any period of time.
One interesting thing to think about when it comes to the Aquatic ape hypothesis and the standard savannah/woodland hypothesis is energy expenditure. Transitioning from quadrupedal to bipedal locomotion is actually insanely efficient. Your skeleton, aka bones, hold you up rather than muscle, and instead of needing muscles to drag/pull/push your body forward, gravity does it for free as a biped. Wading in water is burns a lot of energy. I don't know where that lands but the dichotomy between the two possibilities is interesting.
What a great episode to smoke a joint and listen to on a cool New Jersey night. Thanks for this gift.
https://m.imdb.com/title/tt30180830/
Well now I'm even more excited for this movie
Oh, Chris... tsk, tsk, tsk...
Your lack of experience in interviewing a 'Squatcher' is telling! Don't you know the *most* important question to get to know their stance of the matter is: Shooting a Sasquatch (if you had the chance), Yay or Nay??
;)
Thanks for the veiled shoutout BTW (I'm the friend with a very peculiar opinion about UFOs to anyone reading this). As with the other 'Fortean' mysteries I have studied most of my life, I grew skeptical of the simplistic notion that Bigfoot is simply an undiscovered large hominid roaming North America. A commenter here has already written how First Nation peoples consider them to be a creature living "in between" worlds, and I find that concept fascinating.
Think about it, Mateo's experience happened in a place considered to be 'haunted' by the locals, and yet the *only* reason he determined his first experience to be the work of some prankish primates is because it happened OUTSIDE.
The same way when people see a strange light floating around a military base they think "UFO!" but if the same phenomena happened inside a creepy old mansion they would think "GHOST!"
My smartest Fortean friends consider Sasquatch to be a sort of "poltergeist of the forest" and I think they are on the right track, no pun intended ;)
Anyway, great episode, and I will finish by mentioning I had a chuckle when Mateo conceded that thinking about all this stuff makes one question the nature of reality —SPOILER ALERT: THAT'S THE WHOLE FREAKING POINT :P
I usually love the podcast but found myself checking the date to make sure it wasn't recorded on April 1st and we weren't being had. Another sasquatch "encounter" with no good photos or any evidence - amazing how no one ever gets those! (but we have plenty of night cam footage of mountain lions and all manner of creatures in the forest) And you didn't even actually see one? Dude it could have been anything.
Cool interview Chris—comforting to see your embracing the local Sqatchiness experiences.. If people want a real trip then have a listen to Mike Paterson’s interviews and research.Here in Australia the indigenous peoples of the Yuin Nation call them Dooligah or Yowie.Several Elders that I have spoke to believe that they shape shift and there are sacred sites that are know portals that they shift in and out of. Check out Yowie hunters Witness reports. If anything comes from any of these stories (believing or not) it can give a deeper insight to build the mind bridge from constructed reality and unconscious dream worlds.Like how quantum mechanics is shifting peoples understandings of reality.Peace to the peaceful …Chris your making a difference man with all you do—-big respect and love to you:-)»»»»>
Elaine Morgan is the author of The Aquatic Ape! Here's her TED talk. Great conversation (as always). Looking forward to kicking it with you soon!
https://www.ted.com/talks/elaine_morgan_i_believe_we_evolved_from_aquatic_apes?language=en
Great episode! Chris, asking a Marine vet if he’s a “Semper fi guy” was hilarious. I’ve never heard that one before.
You guys touched on what it’s like to “come out” as a Sasquatch experiencer. I’d like to hear more about that. I’ve heard that a lot of people don’t discuss their experiences much. The whole thing is kinda like talking about being a veteran. Some vets barely mention that they served because some civilians can be weird about that. People sometimes make assumptions about a Marine combat vets sanity as do people make assumptions about filks who say that they have seen a Sasquatch.
Semper Fi Mateo. I served with 3bn 7th Marines as an infantry man from 04’ to 08’ it’s nice to hear a fellow Marine on the podcast.
Im weighing in here perhaps prematurely haha (still on Chris's intro)
But felt an urge to mention that First Nation peoples view Sasquatch as some kind of spirit creature. In some 'in-between' realm. Perhaps dimensionally, or in terms of consciousness and perception....
Interesting episode! I figure I'd drop some random thoughts I had while listening.
As someone who was trained as a satellite technician in the Air Force (now I'm a commercial radio technician) satellites are extremely devoid of power. The majority run on solar power and there wouldn't be near enough power for weaponized lasers. Nuclear power could be used but the amount of power a laser in space would need to destroy a target 22k miles away (if the satellite is in geosynchronous orbit) would be astronomical.
I think your spot on with the drone. It reminds me of something George Carlin said on Dennis Miller's show about why he joined the Air Force "I'd rather fly over the area, drop some bombs, fly home, take a shower, and go out dancing." But I would add that those Nellis Air Force airmen piloting drones have a significant percentage that develop PTSD. Not as high as an infantry man but it still happens nonetheless.
A couple of weeks ago the guys on the MeatEater podcast brought up a study https://zslpublications.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/jzo.13148
that argues every increase of 1,000 black bears in an ecosystem results in a 4% increase in sasquatch sightings. I feel like sasquatch, or any outlier theory for that matter, is an archetype for one or two particular psyches. Those that enjoy the mystery of the unknown or those with an intolerance to ambiguity. The second one in particular is something that I see a lot in different spaces. It drives people to fill in gaps of the unknown with narrative. I see that a lot at work as some technicians can't stand troubleshooting an issue without predetermining what the problem is because it makes them uncomfortable to let the equipment, system, radio, etc. "tell" them the issue. Most the time it sends them down a rabbit whole and out the other side before they find the issue.
At the same time, I get it. I think anyone that's ever been camping in a remote location sitting inside your tent hearing thuds, animals moving around, or grunts, automatically imagine all kinds of possibilities. In those moments of vulnerability anything is conceivable.
The problem with the aquatic ape hypothesis is that most of the supposed aquatic adaptations have other more easily explainable explanations. For example, the nose arching downward is well understood to cause turbulence in the air allowing it to absorb moisture on the way in and eject it on the way out.
The tear thing I have never heard but I do know a couple of things. 1) generally tears, sweat, and saliva, and blood all have the same salinity, about 1% of the total weight of these fluids is from the salt. 2) Water is attracted to sodium and our body takes advantage of this fact by releasing sodium in our sweat gland channels and tear ducts which causes water to chase the sodium up and out of the channels/ducts to the surface of our skin. 3) The higher the intensity of the exercise the higher the sodium content in sweat (if I remember right it can range from something like 400 mg/L to 1800 mg/L but even this changes with heat acclimation). 4) Basal/reflex tears have high salt content (i.e. the 1% while emotional tears are more watery but also contain more hormones. 5) Sea water is on average about 3.5% salinity. I don't know what the tear salinity of aquatic mammals. Maybe dolphins and whales have 1% salinity in their tears. But with the amount of sodium variation in tears and sweat I'd be interested to know when and how it was measured to get the result that went along with the aquatic ape hypothesis.
On humans alone, I have probably 60 or so sweat gland/epithelial bud studies from the 1960s to present and I've never seen it suggested that apocrine glands (the glands that secrete oily/waxy liquid) develop on the head, shoulders, and back. There's a ton of research on the density of eccrine glands on the head (especially forehead) and rest of the body but apocrine glands are usually only found in the underarm/pubic region. Again, I'd like to see where that data was coming from.
In 1987 Kenzo Sato and Fusako Sato talked about a hybrid gland they called the apoeccrine gland that was supposed to be a type of super gland. This gland was still only found in the arm pit area. More recently, researchers have been unable to replicate their findings and see no evidence for this apoeccrine gland.
Two more observations before I call it a day. Does the creator of the aquatic ape hypothesis ever explain how hominins avoided crocodiles in neck deep water? I've often wondered about that. Crocs invade every body of water, and even mud pits. The only thing I could think is if this aquatic existence took place in higher elevations where it was too cold for crocs to exist for any period of time.
One interesting thing to think about when it comes to the Aquatic ape hypothesis and the standard savannah/woodland hypothesis is energy expenditure. Transitioning from quadrupedal to bipedal locomotion is actually insanely efficient. Your skeleton, aka bones, hold you up rather than muscle, and instead of needing muscles to drag/pull/push your body forward, gravity does it for free as a biped. Wading in water is burns a lot of energy. I don't know where that lands but the dichotomy between the two possibilities is interesting.
Great episode! I would love to hear more about Captain Dan and Shaku (spelling?)!!